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| Minister of State, Foreign Affairs II, Senator Musiliu Obanikoro |
Minister of State, Foreign Affairs II, Senator Musiliu Obanikoro, tells BAYO AKINLOYE
that the Peoples Democratic Party will ensure that Saturday’s
governorship election in Lagos State is not rigged in favour of the All
Progressives Congress
Some people
consider you to be the ‘eyes’ and ‘ears’ of President Goodluck Jonathan
in Lagos State. What is your relationship with the President?
I would say I am close enough (to Mr. President) to be one of his ‘boys’ -let’s put it that way.
What made you to be one of his ‘boys’?
I am one of his ministers. I am a loyal party man.
But people think there is
more to your being close to President Jonathan than being one of his
ministers. Why does he have much confidence in you?
You will have to ask Mr. President that
question. This is why I said so: President Jonathan may even love me for
some reasons that I don’t even know. The point, therefore, is that Mr.
President is in a better position to tell you why he puts much
confidence in me.
How do you feel about the President’s loss at the presidential poll?
It is painful. But as a Muslim, I have to
take the loss in stride — God gives, God takes. The fact that President
Jonathan came from nowhere to be the president of the Federal Republic
of Nigeria, almost effortlessly, was an act of God. (In the same way)
that (Maj. Gen. Muhammadu) Buhari won the just concluded presidential
election is also an act of God. Therefore, I take it that it is only God
that counts.
The Peoples Democratic Party
has always said that it would rule Nigeria for 60 years. But after 16
years, the party has lost grip on power at the centre. What happened?
Let me make this clear: man proposes, God
disposes. The point is encapsulated in the statement I made earlier
that it is only God that counts.
But, didn’t anything go wrong to the extent that the President lost in the poll?
A lot went wrong. Nevertheless, in the
face of all those wrongs if God had wanted the President to be
re-elected, he would have been returned as the President. Something will
always go wrong in human endeavours, anyway; it is human. Many things
went wrong and there is no doubt about that because the presidential
poll was an election we were supposed to win.
What exactly will you say went wrong?
For me, I think it is too early to be
deliberating on that. I do not want people to characterise us (PDP) as
bad losers. The truth of the matter is that the President has
congratulated Buhari. Let us leave that (the issue of what wrong) for
now. At the appropriate time we would talk about some of the things that
went wrong. Do not also forget that we have an election coming up. In
view of that, we cannot be dwelling on what went wrong — when we have
another challenge ahead of us. (Dwelling on such wrongs) may further
demoralise the people. On the contrary, we want to dwell on things that
will energise our people and re-structure their frame of mind for now.
Looking at irregularities during the
March 28 poll, we can talk about them all day — it is not just about the
irregularities in Lagos. We can talk about the underage voting in the
North. The connivance of the All Progressives Congress with the
Independent National Electoral Commission in Lagos is also something
that is mind-boggling and painful. Particularly in Lagos, most of the
results that the INEC ought to have declared for PDP were declared for
APC. And do you know that in some local government areas in Lagos State
INEC did not bring election result sheets. They went somewhere else to
doctor the results or fill it to suit the APC, who is their paymaster.
These are some of the issues we are going to face on Saturday. And we
are going to deal with these squarely. It is either INEC stands up and
becomes an impartial arbiter which they are supposed to be or we will
also challenge them squarely. But that to me (not standing up to be an
impartial arbiter) is not an honourable path for them.
The honourable path is for INEC to sit or
stand on the side of the people. Using their official position to
hijack the mandate of the people and giving it to the people who have
lost the election is very sad and unacceptable.
Focusing on the Lagos
governorship election, what is your relationship with Jimi Agbaje
considering the fact that some see Agbaje as being Chief Bode George and
Senator Adeseye Ogunlewe’s ‘boy’ and you being on the opposing side?
Jimi Agbaje is his own person. He is
nobody’s man. He is a very independent man. He is a man with a strong
history of political activism. Do not forget that Agbaje was a member of
the Afenifere group in which he played an active role. Apparently, he
is not someone anyone can say, ‘Jimi is my boy’ or ‘Jimi is in my
pocket.’ (Whoever thinks that way) I think that person will only be
deluding himself -the person will only be living in fantasy because
Agbaje will end up being his own man. And, that is what we need in Lagos
today; that is why we are calling for change in Lagos today. We need a
man who can stand on his own, who will not be anybody’s lackey.
Therefore, talking about my relationship
with Agbaje it can’t be better. Let me add, what people do not know is
that when we were having that serious political contest (PDP
governorship primary in Lagos), Agbaje and I were still very close and
our children are best of friends. This is probably the first time I have
talked about this. It is in the imagination of the people to think that
I will not want Jimi Agbaje to win the governorship election (slated
for April 11). It is in my interest for Agbaje to win as it is in the
interest of Lagos. There is no better time in the history of Lagos where
the choice is very clear between two candidates. One that is very
progressive in every sense of it with a clear record of public advocacy,
of good governance and strong support for democracy, as opposed to
someone coming from a civil service background, who we know very well,
is going to be managed by someone whose tenure in Lagos is better
forgotten than remembered.
Ahead of the governorship
election in Lagos, how will you describe the chances of PDP since the
thinking of some people is that you would have stood a better chance
than Agbaje?
Let me tell you something; I have my
strengths and Jimi Agbaje also has a lot of things that I can speak
positively about. Thus, I think it is not fair to begin to bring me into
the picture with just a few days to the election. My support for him is
also complementary; because if you say, ‘Obanikoro has this, and Agbaje
doesn’t have this.’ Or, if you say, ‘Agbaje has this, Obanikoro doesn’t
have this,’ now that we are working together, we will complement each
other for the good of Lagos. That is the way God has created this world:
some will have certain things others will not. Others will have certain
things some will not -but when the two now come together it will serve
as complementary possibilities of what each person brings to the table.
Are you saying you are 100 per cent behind Agbaje?
If there is something more than 100 per
cent, I am behind Agbaje. I am totally with him. I am not just with him
for political reasons. I am with him because if you put the two (Ambode
and Agbaje) together, Agbaje is a better candidate. And that explains — I
was listening to Ambode’s jingle on radio where he was talking about
the dream — our dreams — and I would have loved for him to be courageous
enough to have a debate with Jimi Agbaje to show Lagosians what those
dreams are all about and how those dreams will be achieved. The two
debates they had Agbaje stood out in terms of presentation of his vision
for Lagos and how to achieve it. Ambode could not even defend some of
the facts that he has been talking about. Hence, the difference between
Agbaje and Ambode is like the difference between day and night.
If you look at the background of Jimi
Agbaje, he has always been on the side of the progressives all his life
whereas you cannot say the same thing about Ambode. And there are many
things that Ambode needs to talk about: How was the N20bn Lagos
collected from the Federal Government expended? Who got what? I know he
will not have a convincing explanation on that. I believe that Lagosians
are very wise and inasmuch as they can talk about change at the centre
and they are afraid of change in Lagos, it goes to show that the APC
cannot be trusted.
Going by the pattern of
voting in the presidential and National Assembly polls, APC is expected
to win in the April 11 election. To prevent this from happening, what
does PDP intend to do differently?
Whoever says APC is likely to win in the
coming governorship election did not know about what transpired during
the presidential poll. The election was rigged in favour of APC. We
intend to be more vigilant and we are going to put our cards on the
table for INEC. They must bring result sheets to the polling units.
Results must be announced immediately they are available. What they did
the last time was to ‘arrest’ results, went somewhere and tinker with
them before announcing them. Even where we won it was the number of
votes that gave us the victory that made it possible. They also tinkered
with those votes to arrive at a conclusion that is favourable to the
APC. For instance, in Ajeromi — Ifelodun, we won and the election was
completed and concluded early enough, making it possible for the
commission to announce the result on the day of the election but INEC
refused to do that. Why? Because they wanted to tinker with the result.
They also attempted to do same in Surulere, Governor Babatunde Fashola’s
local government where we won hands down.
These are things that we will not allow
in the coming governorship election. We have to be more vigilant and we
are not going to tolerate all those things that transpired in Mushin and
Shomolu during the last election where the APC colluded with INEC to
deprive us of our hard-earned victories — and even in Epe, Ibeju-Lekki
and Badagry they did the same thing. All over the state they were
manipulating results. And we are also going to implore the people of
Lagos State not to go anywhere immediately after the election. They
should stay at their polling units and watch the results counted. People
should be vigilant on Saturday. These people are desperate to win the
election. They are going around harassing market people, traders,
artisans, Igbos and other non-Yoruba-speaking people who are supporting
the PDP threatening them and we are saying we are growing our democracy.
Election is not just about casting votes; and these are the processes
that these people are trying to interfere with. Once you hijack that,
you arrest the processes and whatever you are putting on that is
rubbish. And that is precisely what they are doing. Recently, it was
reported that these people went to Ladipo Market to threaten the market
people there that if they don’t vote for them they will wipe them off.
Should a democrat act that way?
What role should security operatives play in the April 11 election?
I believe that they must be neutral as
much as possible. That is the only way the election can be free and
fair. And after the election we will have a peaceful atmosphere.
What is your plan for 2019?
For me, as regards politics and elective
positions I think I am winding down. My son is already contesting for a
political post. I think what my role should be now is to encourage him
and support him to any level he wants to participate. It should not be
my place now to be usurping or trying to lead the future of my own kids.
I will defer to them and stay under this Yoruba proverb, ‘Erin ku o fowo boju; ogede ku o fomo e ropo.’
As we move to the backstage it is necessary to ensure that we put
forward a befitting successor or successors who will take over the baton
from us. Therefore, we are gradually winding down and we are
encouraging the younger elements to take over while we guide them and
give them the necessary support.
Does that mean you are no more interested in being the governor of Lagos?
I am saying that I am more or less thinking of being in the background than being the one to be contesting elections.
What if the people say it’s Obanikoro they want at that time?
When we get to the bridge we will cross
it. After all, Buhari is 73 years old and he is now the president of
Nigeria. And, mind you, it’s to promote my kids rather than promote
myself. But if God says otherwise who am I?
Going down memory lane, why
did you leave the Alliance for Democracy (which has now gone through
several metamorphoses to become APC) for the PDP?
I left because of the leadership. That
inconsistency itself has vindicated me. That the party has moved from
Alliance for Democracy to Action Congress to Action Congress of Nigeria
and now All Progressives Congress. That inconsistency is a vindication.
What people are now seeing about the leaders of the APC in Lagos is what
I saw; that the interest of the people is being put in jeopardy; that
the interest of the people is secondary to their personal interest and
that can better be explained when you look at the more than N200bn that a
firm collected as consultancy in 16 years from Lagos State. That is to
show that the leader of the APC in Lagos is more interested in personal
interest than public interest. Just imagine what that amount of money
could have done for the public good. More so, where our children are
sitting on bare floors in schools, no toilets or water in our schools,
even in our homes, where hospitals have been reduced to consulting
rooms, where Lagos government is always in a running battle with medical
doctors, where civil servants are not paid minimum wage, yet they can
afford to pay before now N8bn per month, N6bn per month and now N1.5bn
per month on an individual in a state where the governor woke up two or
three years ago and increased school fees in Lagos State University
without looking inward.
Even though the fees had been reviewed
downward after two years, can the review compensate for the pain that he
has caused in people’s lives? Can it compensate for those who dropped
out of school based on that single act of increasing the tuition? Has he
compensated them for that? No. Lives have been lost. And no amount of
talk can save or change that. We have lost lives that ordinarily should
have been very bright. Parents have been subjected to undue agony and
pain — how is he going to compensate people for that? How? Careers have
been destroyed with standard of education in LASU falling and I can tell
you for the free that I do not know of anywhere outside Nigeria where
anybody would accept LASU’s certificate. It is a very pathetic
situation.
There is an erroneous perception of
individuals who are supposed to be condemned but who are being
celebrated in our society; people who do not mean well for public good;
people whose antecedents have never been the welfare of the people but
that of personal interest. How can one explain someone enacting into law
a bill that gives someone the right to use government money after
serving as a governor to buy a property of his choice in Lagos and
another one in Abuja? How does one justify that? Is there anywhere in
the world -in a civilised world -other than Lagos where that can be
explained? This is ridiculous and criminal. Lagos people should stand up
against that. The day PDP wins Lagos State, that’s the day Agbaje will
go back to the House of Assembly and ensure that the law is struck down.
Such a law is anti-people
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